Hellhammer
Jun 23, 04:11 AM
No thank you! Touch is useless in computer size of an iMac as after 10 mins your arma are full of pain and it's ridiculously slow too.
jp102235
Mar 25, 04:08 PM
There's still the practical limitations of using a touchscreen as a control device, though. It's never going to be as tactile as a controller with buttons and joysticks. Not to mention having the HDMI adaptor sticking out of the side of the iPad while you're holding it to play games...
Apart from that, I'm glad to see the iPad is able to hold its own as a gaming machine.
amazing, especially if you can build a steering wheel receptacle that holds the ipad, and converts the hdmi out to a wireless signal (an hdmi to ATSC would be a perfect soln... hmmm... I'll need an analog design engineer to help me out though...)
like this:
http://www.ismashphone.com/2009/08/where-the-rubber-meets-the-road-iphone-accessories.html
http://www.ismashphone.com/2010/02/its-the-wheel-thing-ipad-steeringwheel-controller-in-the-offing.html
Apart from that, I'm glad to see the iPad is able to hold its own as a gaming machine.
amazing, especially if you can build a steering wheel receptacle that holds the ipad, and converts the hdmi out to a wireless signal (an hdmi to ATSC would be a perfect soln... hmmm... I'll need an analog design engineer to help me out though...)
like this:
http://www.ismashphone.com/2009/08/where-the-rubber-meets-the-road-iphone-accessories.html
http://www.ismashphone.com/2010/02/its-the-wheel-thing-ipad-steeringwheel-controller-in-the-offing.html
jsm4182
Feb 27, 02:39 PM
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5292/5482714927_dde07ab2f6.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/jsm382/5482714927/)
I thought its about time I post my home setup.
Just bought the 27" Cinema Display, its connected to my 13"MBP running in clamshell,sitting on the shelf on a cooling pad.
Apple bluetooth keyboard, Magic Trackpad and Magic Mouse. Have 2 Apple battery chargers(not pictured) to power those 3.
1TB Seagate GoFlex with firewire 800 upgrade kit for backups using Carbon Copy Cloner sitting behind the lamp.
Creative Xmod that I use with my Bose OE headphones(headphones not pictured).
Also not pictured is my table at the other end of that wall with a Brother laser printer and Crosley radio, both hooked up to an Airport Express. And in a cabinet in another room I have an Airport Extreme with 2 Seagate 1TB drives for Time Machine and old file storage.
I thought its about time I post my home setup.
Just bought the 27" Cinema Display, its connected to my 13"MBP running in clamshell,sitting on the shelf on a cooling pad.
Apple bluetooth keyboard, Magic Trackpad and Magic Mouse. Have 2 Apple battery chargers(not pictured) to power those 3.
1TB Seagate GoFlex with firewire 800 upgrade kit for backups using Carbon Copy Cloner sitting behind the lamp.
Creative Xmod that I use with my Bose OE headphones(headphones not pictured).
Also not pictured is my table at the other end of that wall with a Brother laser printer and Crosley radio, both hooked up to an Airport Express. And in a cabinet in another room I have an Airport Extreme with 2 Seagate 1TB drives for Time Machine and old file storage.
KnightWRX
Apr 27, 09:55 AM
Capitalization wasn't the point. It's the context in which a term or _name_ is used.
Context doesn't impact a trademark either. The only thing that would permit anyone to use the "App Store" trademark if it was granted would be outside of Apple's selected field of trade.
I could call my restaurant "App Store" because Apple did not trademark App Store as it relates to restoration and food. I could call my new Car model the "GM App Store", as it does not relate to the field in which Apple trademarked it.
I can't however call my store that sells Applications "App Store" or use "App Store" in a portion of its name, or for the slogan "KnightMarket : The best darn App Store!"
That is why descriptive trademarks aren't usually awarded and granted. Because it gives too much power to a single entity in a certain field of trade. We'll see how the USPTO decides this when they hand in their final decision in Apple's request, especially now that Microsoft filed in the opposition phase (which is exactly why the USPTO has an opposition phase to begin with).
Context doesn't impact a trademark either. The only thing that would permit anyone to use the "App Store" trademark if it was granted would be outside of Apple's selected field of trade.
I could call my restaurant "App Store" because Apple did not trademark App Store as it relates to restoration and food. I could call my new Car model the "GM App Store", as it does not relate to the field in which Apple trademarked it.
I can't however call my store that sells Applications "App Store" or use "App Store" in a portion of its name, or for the slogan "KnightMarket : The best darn App Store!"
That is why descriptive trademarks aren't usually awarded and granted. Because it gives too much power to a single entity in a certain field of trade. We'll see how the USPTO decides this when they hand in their final decision in Apple's request, especially now that Microsoft filed in the opposition phase (which is exactly why the USPTO has an opposition phase to begin with).
appleguy123
Jun 22, 09:11 PM
Ah yes. A porn free, tightly censored, code controlled desktop machine. That's what everyone wants right? :rolleyes:
Actually maybe.
Actually maybe.
coder12
Apr 21, 12:20 PM
Good catch! I just noticed this once you pointed it out.
I will be having fun with this +1 deally...
I will be having fun with this +1 deally...
guzhogi
Nov 15, 10:16 AM
Applications should be, and most likely are written to take advantage of available resources. A developer should be writing applications to take advantage of 8-cores already, they don't need an 8-core machine to do so.
I agree. I wonder how idle the graphics card is when not using games. It would really help if more programmers were able to write programs that take advantage of the graphics card and audio card. Too bad SoundBlaster cards are Windows only. I wonder how much faster ripping CDs and converting to different audio formats in iTunes would be if the instructions got offloaded to a Soundblaster or other sound card.
I also heard of a company called Aspex Semiconductors (www.aspex-semi.com) that designs PCI cards that speed up video processing and has something like OpenGL, but called OpenRL for video processing.. Would be cool if Aspex & Apple teamed up to make a card for Mac Pros to speed up Final Cut Pro & iMovie. Just my 2 cents.
I agree. I wonder how idle the graphics card is when not using games. It would really help if more programmers were able to write programs that take advantage of the graphics card and audio card. Too bad SoundBlaster cards are Windows only. I wonder how much faster ripping CDs and converting to different audio formats in iTunes would be if the instructions got offloaded to a Soundblaster or other sound card.
I also heard of a company called Aspex Semiconductors (www.aspex-semi.com) that designs PCI cards that speed up video processing and has something like OpenGL, but called OpenRL for video processing.. Would be cool if Aspex & Apple teamed up to make a card for Mac Pros to speed up Final Cut Pro & iMovie. Just my 2 cents.
RodThePlod
Sep 7, 07:00 AM
Even though Apple is Apple, going up against Amazon, which will have more movie options at the time of launch is going to be tough...
unless... they release some sort of new hardware [full screen ipod, plzkthx] that will take the spotlight.
Here's hoping for "one more thing"... on Sept 12.
I think it's funny that this is pretty much the only mention of Amazon in this thread... even though Amazon will be announcing a competing movie store in a few days with supposedly much more content than Apple's offering! :D
It just shows how people think that Amazon will simply not be able to compete with what Apple has up it's sleeve. You just *know* that Apple would not announce this thing until they had the end-to-end user experience worked out to perfection - iPod-iTunes styleee - effectively using hardware and software that works seamlessly and that anyone can pick up and use.
In contrast, Amazon will launch a service that will have a very comprehensive back catalog but will be frustrating to use as after downloading your movie, your options will be:
Free graffiti fonts alphabets
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Graffiti Fonts Number Alphabet
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free graffiti fonts alphabet.
unless... they release some sort of new hardware [full screen ipod, plzkthx] that will take the spotlight.
Here's hoping for "one more thing"... on Sept 12.
I think it's funny that this is pretty much the only mention of Amazon in this thread... even though Amazon will be announcing a competing movie store in a few days with supposedly much more content than Apple's offering! :D
It just shows how people think that Amazon will simply not be able to compete with what Apple has up it's sleeve. You just *know* that Apple would not announce this thing until they had the end-to-end user experience worked out to perfection - iPod-iTunes styleee - effectively using hardware and software that works seamlessly and that anyone can pick up and use.
In contrast, Amazon will launch a service that will have a very comprehensive back catalog but will be frustrating to use as after downloading your movie, your options will be:
bcharna
Aug 6, 11:21 PM
I can't sleep.
MacRumors, stop making me dwell on this!!
PS, is anyone here waiting for Mac support for the Slingbox? Thats pissing me off too!
MacRumors, stop making me dwell on this!!
PS, is anyone here waiting for Mac support for the Slingbox? Thats pissing me off too!
JRoDDz
Mar 26, 10:56 AM
That video makes me want to go fire up my PS3 :eek:
Multimedia
Sep 7, 11:31 AM
Did I miss something or did the top end mini model go from $799 to $599. Ok. it has a smaller drive and no superdrive. BUt who uses DVDs anymore?I do. That's how I archive all my HDTV and SDTV recordings. I burn Disk Images with Toast then rip those images to mp4 files with Handbrake to take what starts out as a 6GB HD master and winds up a 351MB mp4 file that looks almost as good as the original - just a little softer is all. So I can get 12 one hour prime time HDTV shows on one 4.38GB DVD or two on a 702.8MB CD.
For me this is the future of TV show recording and storage. I've got it down to a science that is as good as is possible with today's technology to get something that is very big to be very small and still deliver a decent viewing-listening experience on a HD Screen while remaining iPod compatible at the same time.
Only drawback is computing power. Even the 3GHz Mac Pro is too slow to do this in rapid time. So it takes a more time than the programs lengths to do right now that should in future take only a few minutes each. I'm hoping that amount of power will be with us by 2008 or 2009. It's a fundamental challenge that needs to get solved before what I am doing can have mass appeal. It's almost tlike a full itme job - no it is a full time job. Except I'm not getting paid to do it. :eek:
For me this is the future of TV show recording and storage. I've got it down to a science that is as good as is possible with today's technology to get something that is very big to be very small and still deliver a decent viewing-listening experience on a HD Screen while remaining iPod compatible at the same time.
Only drawback is computing power. Even the 3GHz Mac Pro is too slow to do this in rapid time. So it takes a more time than the programs lengths to do right now that should in future take only a few minutes each. I'm hoping that amount of power will be with us by 2008 or 2009. It's a fundamental challenge that needs to get solved before what I am doing can have mass appeal. It's almost tlike a full itme job - no it is a full time job. Except I'm not getting paid to do it. :eek:
KnightWRX
Apr 27, 01:12 PM
I was simply suggesting that Apple used the term "App" as a familiar leaning to the way they call software "Applications" in Mac OS. Also, Apple have being refering to software that runs on their operating systems as "Applications" since 1980: -
The Apple Lisa (precursor to the original 1984 Macintosh) had an Applications folder in 1980.
http://www.guidebookgallery.org/articles/inventingthelisauserinterface/pics/fig6
The Macintosh has obviously had an Applications folder from 1984 to present
In terms of GUI history and it's conventions, there was the Xerox Alto as far back as 1973 but from all the screen shot hunting I've done, it seems to have no Applications or Programs folder because it has a "starting point" (indicated by the Start box) and then a list of files to open, some of which end in .run which presumably are executable programs/applications: -
http://www.computerhistory.org/revolution/input-output/14/347/1857
So yeah, "The Macintosh" wasn't the first GUI that had APPlicationS but Apple appear to have a LOT of prior use of the term with the Lisa OS before it in 1980 and GUI consistency between Mac OS X and iOS being a cut down version OS X, they logically refer to Applications on iOS devices in a cut down form too.
And all of that doesn't matter. Apple refers to software as Applications because that's what the whole industry does. Microsoft, IBM, Google, Sun, HP, the industry has always used Application to refer to software (Program has also been used). App has always been the shortened form of Application, heck in the 80s, Visicalc was referred to as the "Killer app" for Apple computers.
Your ranting as no relevance to the case at hand. Apple has no more claim to the term than anyone else and App or Application is not the trademark being discussed here.
The Apple Lisa (precursor to the original 1984 Macintosh) had an Applications folder in 1980.
http://www.guidebookgallery.org/articles/inventingthelisauserinterface/pics/fig6
The Macintosh has obviously had an Applications folder from 1984 to present
In terms of GUI history and it's conventions, there was the Xerox Alto as far back as 1973 but from all the screen shot hunting I've done, it seems to have no Applications or Programs folder because it has a "starting point" (indicated by the Start box) and then a list of files to open, some of which end in .run which presumably are executable programs/applications: -
http://www.computerhistory.org/revolution/input-output/14/347/1857
So yeah, "The Macintosh" wasn't the first GUI that had APPlicationS but Apple appear to have a LOT of prior use of the term with the Lisa OS before it in 1980 and GUI consistency between Mac OS X and iOS being a cut down version OS X, they logically refer to Applications on iOS devices in a cut down form too.
And all of that doesn't matter. Apple refers to software as Applications because that's what the whole industry does. Microsoft, IBM, Google, Sun, HP, the industry has always used Application to refer to software (Program has also been used). App has always been the shortened form of Application, heck in the 80s, Visicalc was referred to as the "Killer app" for Apple computers.
Your ranting as no relevance to the case at hand. Apple has no more claim to the term than anyone else and App or Application is not the trademark being discussed here.
blybug
Jan 12, 06:21 PM
I'll tell you why I'd buy a MacBook Air or Thin or Light, and ideally it would be some tablet-style offspring/hybrid of a MacBook and iPhone...Medical Documentation. Here's (sort of) what we're using in my hospital now:
http://www.interiormall.com/images/cat/furn/COW20-CoverDW1_b.jpg
Except ours don't even look that elegant. It's called a "COW" for Computer On Wheels and it is the kludgiest most inconvenient way to move room to room and patient to patient. I can actually access our system by VNSea to my office computer from my hacked iPhone and get more reliable and consistent WiFi reception and UI than using these stupid Dell COWS. I'd buy a iPhoneMEGA or MacBooknano (iPad??!) to walk around with in a heartbeat. Even if the OS itself is limited, as long as it had some sort of Back To My Mac or VNC client on it, it would literally take the place of that ridiculous COW in my life.
http://www.interiormall.com/images/cat/furn/COW20-CoverDW1_b.jpg
Except ours don't even look that elegant. It's called a "COW" for Computer On Wheels and it is the kludgiest most inconvenient way to move room to room and patient to patient. I can actually access our system by VNSea to my office computer from my hacked iPhone and get more reliable and consistent WiFi reception and UI than using these stupid Dell COWS. I'd buy a iPhoneMEGA or MacBooknano (iPad??!) to walk around with in a heartbeat. Even if the OS itself is limited, as long as it had some sort of Back To My Mac or VNC client on it, it would literally take the place of that ridiculous COW in my life.
Killyp
Aug 7, 04:48 AM
I like the UK. B&O have their entire product range here, wheras they don't in Australia...
Herdfan
Apr 20, 04:28 PM
Common Upgrades
1. Thunderbolt port
2. HDMI out
3. Sandybridge
Why would they put an HDMI port on it when they can just put the TB port on and then sell an adapter? Win-win for them.
1. Thunderbolt port
2. HDMI out
3. Sandybridge
Why would they put an HDMI port on it when they can just put the TB port on and then sell an adapter? Win-win for them.
DouchGod
Nov 24, 02:53 AM
Building myself a new computer:
Asus Crosshair IV Formula AMD 890FX (Socket AM3) DDR3 Motherboard
http://www.alphacity.co.nz/images/electronics/Crosshair-IV-Formula.jpg
Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 6850 1024MB GDDR5 PCI-Express Graphics Card
http://images.bizrate.com/resize?sq=300&uid=2261268837
AMD Phenom II X6 Six Core 1055T 2.80GHz
http://static.letsbuyit.com/filer/images/uk/products/original/201/7/amd-phenom-ii-x6-1055t-six-core-processor-2-80-ghz-9mb-cache-socket-am3-125w-45-nm-3-year-war-20107372.jpeg
G.Skill RipJaw 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 PC3-10666C9 1333MHz Dual Channel Kit
http://p.gzhls.at/466065.jpg
Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-Bit - OEM
http://www.gttkc.com/shop/images/7professional.jpeg
NZXT Phantom Enthusiast Full Tower Case - Black
http://www.thebitbag.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/phantom_black_blue_LED2.jpg
2* Samsung SpinPoint F3 1TB SATA-II 32MB Cache - OEM
http://www.awd-it.co.uk/ProdImages/3438_Samsung_Spinpoint_F1_HD753LJ_750GB_SATA_II_32MB_Cache_-_OEM_xl.jpg
Currently sat waiting for it to be delivered.....
Asus Crosshair IV Formula AMD 890FX (Socket AM3) DDR3 Motherboard
http://www.alphacity.co.nz/images/electronics/Crosshair-IV-Formula.jpg
Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 6850 1024MB GDDR5 PCI-Express Graphics Card
http://images.bizrate.com/resize?sq=300&uid=2261268837
AMD Phenom II X6 Six Core 1055T 2.80GHz
http://static.letsbuyit.com/filer/images/uk/products/original/201/7/amd-phenom-ii-x6-1055t-six-core-processor-2-80-ghz-9mb-cache-socket-am3-125w-45-nm-3-year-war-20107372.jpeg
G.Skill RipJaw 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 PC3-10666C9 1333MHz Dual Channel Kit
http://p.gzhls.at/466065.jpg
Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-Bit - OEM
http://www.gttkc.com/shop/images/7professional.jpeg
NZXT Phantom Enthusiast Full Tower Case - Black
http://www.thebitbag.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/phantom_black_blue_LED2.jpg
2* Samsung SpinPoint F3 1TB SATA-II 32MB Cache - OEM
http://www.awd-it.co.uk/ProdImages/3438_Samsung_Spinpoint_F1_HD753LJ_750GB_SATA_II_32MB_Cache_-_OEM_xl.jpg
Currently sat waiting for it to be delivered.....
DanChosich
Oct 23, 04:12 PM
Unless the new MBPs are shipping tomorrow..:rolleyes:
I know you will see that I've never posted before, so anything I say will probably be taken with a grain of salt. I don't blame you for not believing me, every Tuesday I am let down with all of you. If I am lying you can ban me from this forum, for whatever it's worth, I promise what I'm telling you is the truth. I see you guys are as antsy as I am about this update.
I know a person that works at an Apple Store as an inventory control specialist - I asked him back in July to tell me before hand if he knew when the Merom MacBook Pro was coming out. Today I got a text message from him saying, "(dan's) laptop might be coming out tomorrow." However, he thinks it's only a 15''.
Something is definitely planned to come out tomorrow. I know it's not concrete, but it gives me hope. I figured I would share.
I'm hoping he is wrong about the 15'' thing, I wanted a 17''. Either way, I'll take what I can get. I've been waitng too long.
I know you will see that I've never posted before, so anything I say will probably be taken with a grain of salt. I don't blame you for not believing me, every Tuesday I am let down with all of you. If I am lying you can ban me from this forum, for whatever it's worth, I promise what I'm telling you is the truth. I see you guys are as antsy as I am about this update.
I know a person that works at an Apple Store as an inventory control specialist - I asked him back in July to tell me before hand if he knew when the Merom MacBook Pro was coming out. Today I got a text message from him saying, "(dan's) laptop might be coming out tomorrow." However, he thinks it's only a 15''.
Something is definitely planned to come out tomorrow. I know it's not concrete, but it gives me hope. I figured I would share.
I'm hoping he is wrong about the 15'' thing, I wanted a 17''. Either way, I'll take what I can get. I've been waitng too long.
poppe
Jul 14, 12:20 PM
Early June. Its middle of July. Where is it? Wheres the player? They're showing of a prototype disc? Its world away from ever reaching my computer.
So one company doesn't display it that means that the other companies that are working on it couldn't have it out by end of 2006/early 2007 as I stated earlier?
Dell didn't release a workstation. Hp must not either
So one company doesn't display it that means that the other companies that are working on it couldn't have it out by end of 2006/early 2007 as I stated earlier?
Dell didn't release a workstation. Hp must not either
benjayman2
Feb 26, 10:39 AM
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/68/csb1.jpg
You beat me to it lol.
I'd post pics of our new room but my camera is so 1999 :p
You beat me to it lol.
I'd post pics of our new room but my camera is so 1999 :p
LondonCentral
Mar 22, 11:52 PM
end the classic? Please no! It's great for storing large libraries, uncompressed music/complete music + video libraries and you are able to use it without looking. iOS is fun to look at, but the ipod app is terrible and can't replace tactile controls. I also hate using my phone as a music player as phone calls require me to interface with the player, rather than just take out my earbuds and answer the call (much faster and easier)
The real, and best, reason to not discontinue it is that the classic represents Apples first big win. Its a very symbolic design, and I doubt they will be retiring it...ever. Much like porsche and the carrera, or Ford and the F-150.
The classic IS the ipod. Notice how people still call the ipod touch the "itouch". Few think of it as "the ipod".
There always be a market for a slim, easy to use, portable, high capacity music player with touch controls.
I've never heard anyone call it the iTouch until I read your post.
They're all iPods of one sort or another, simple. Everything changes, everything moves forwards...embrace the change.
Use the clickwheel in your mind....
Yes, I just said that. :|
The real, and best, reason to not discontinue it is that the classic represents Apples first big win. Its a very symbolic design, and I doubt they will be retiring it...ever. Much like porsche and the carrera, or Ford and the F-150.
The classic IS the ipod. Notice how people still call the ipod touch the "itouch". Few think of it as "the ipod".
There always be a market for a slim, easy to use, portable, high capacity music player with touch controls.
I've never heard anyone call it the iTouch until I read your post.
They're all iPods of one sort or another, simple. Everything changes, everything moves forwards...embrace the change.
Use the clickwheel in your mind....
Yes, I just said that. :|
Panther71
Oct 21, 04:38 PM
I just received my Proporta aluminum-lined leather case. I got it from Amazon for $29.95 with free shipping. It is exactly what I was looking for in a case that will protect the screen when I have my Ipod Touch in my pocket. It is a quality built case at a very good price for a leather case.
Intell
Apr 9, 04:39 PM
"rare"? In what part of the world are they "rare"?
Yes, I can drive them. Both American and European.
Yes, I can drive them. Both American and European.
aiqw9182
Mar 24, 02:27 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8F190 Safari/6533.18.5)
Don't fall for anandtechs crap. Those tests where designed to make Intels GPU look good. The minute you do anything demanding the GPU falls flat on it's face. By this I mean turn on all the latest features to get the best on screen results.
For many other reasons I don't consider anandtech to be a credible web site. It has become an extension of Intels marketing team. A lot of people don't want to hear that but there is a trend in the articles that indicate that they have become a fan site and have lost the ability to report objectively.
Lol, OK BRO. They were designed to make the Intel GPU look good? That's pretty hilarious. Then you post a video of you comparing the 320M and Intel 3000 under OS X playing Starcraft 2 and tell me your results that prove those benchmarks wrong.
With only a couple months difference in release date, Sandy Bridge is a bad purchase.
Yeah, because we all know how lovely AMD's desktop processors have been. :rolleyes: Let alone their mobile processors. The only thing they have going for them is their price. If you want a better processor, buy Sandy Bridge. If you want a better GPU, buy Llano. Or just buy a Sandy Bridge machine with a discrete GPU that take a crap all over both the Llano and Intel's IGP. Stop with your unreleased AMD propaganda.
Don't fall for anandtechs crap. Those tests where designed to make Intels GPU look good. The minute you do anything demanding the GPU falls flat on it's face. By this I mean turn on all the latest features to get the best on screen results.
For many other reasons I don't consider anandtech to be a credible web site. It has become an extension of Intels marketing team. A lot of people don't want to hear that but there is a trend in the articles that indicate that they have become a fan site and have lost the ability to report objectively.
Lol, OK BRO. They were designed to make the Intel GPU look good? That's pretty hilarious. Then you post a video of you comparing the 320M and Intel 3000 under OS X playing Starcraft 2 and tell me your results that prove those benchmarks wrong.
With only a couple months difference in release date, Sandy Bridge is a bad purchase.
Yeah, because we all know how lovely AMD's desktop processors have been. :rolleyes: Let alone their mobile processors. The only thing they have going for them is their price. If you want a better processor, buy Sandy Bridge. If you want a better GPU, buy Llano. Or just buy a Sandy Bridge machine with a discrete GPU that take a crap all over both the Llano and Intel's IGP. Stop with your unreleased AMD propaganda.
Linito
Dec 4, 12:58 PM
Actually, I was thinking they were working on a car ;)
no no no think big, an airplane or a satellite maybe even a spaceshuttle :p
no no no think big, an airplane or a satellite maybe even a spaceshuttle :p
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